--- Log opened Fri Aug 19 00:00:20 2011
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01:28 < prudhvi> Are there any git bindings for go?
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01:30 < str1ngs> https://github.com/str1ngs/go-git
01:30 < chilts> prudhvi: I found this a day or so ago, but not sure of the
status -> https://github.com/edsrzf/go-git
01:30 < str1ngs> I have not work on them in awhile so your milage may verry
01:30 < prudhvi> thanks str1ngs chilts
01:31 < str1ngs> I'm confuse why edsrzf named his project the same as mine
:(
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01:35 < str1ngs> prudhvi: if you are serious about using the binding let me
know I can bring them upto speed.  so far though I have not been given much feed
back on them
01:35 < chilts> str1ngs: what's the status of your libs?  workable?
working?  mostly complete?
01:35 < chilts> ah ok
01:35 < chilts> str1ngs: I think it doesn't matter since with GitHub you
have your own namespace so no-one can hijack you
01:35 < str1ngs> they are workable with the libgit2 submodule included.  to
a limited degree
01:36 < str1ngs> edsrzf solution might be better in the long run since its
native.  as far as I have seen
01:37 < chilts> str1ngs: I'd say opposite, I'd libgit2 would be the winner
since they'll probably be maintained better and longer (esp.  if other languages
keep doing bindings to it)
01:37 < chilts> then you know you implemented it correctly too :)
01:38 < str1ngs> thats partly why I picked libgit2 its well maintain and
documented
01:38 < str1ngs> also actively being used.  ie.  github for mac uses it
01:39 < str1ngs> orginally I did not plan to make bindings however made
sense to once I started hacking on it
01:39 < chilts> if I had to pick one, I'd probably go with your one rather
than a native one
01:39 < str1ngs> the problem is I'm not a C programmer so when I do work on
it, its slow an tedious
01:40 < str1ngs> but it is a start.
01:40 < chilts> right
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02:08 < araujo> Does Go implement already a C-like union equivalent?
02:09 < exch> nope
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04:21 < s|k> how does one log into hg code review if you have two factor
auth enabled
04:21 < s|k> generate a new password everytime you login?
04:21 < s|k> heh
04:22 < s|k> hg code-login I mean
04:23 < str1ngs> if something generally does not support two factor , you
need to generated a application password for it
04:23 < str1ngs> then use that password.  however I do not know if this
works with code review.
04:26 < s|k> right
04:26 < s|k> it probably will
04:26 < s|k> but I'd have to generate a new password each time I logged in
right
04:26 < s|k> let me try that
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04:27 < s|k> yes a generated password worked
04:29 < str1ngs> no usually after that you can use that password.  they tend
to time out though
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04:32 < s|k> you can't reuse a generated password
04:33 < s|k> if the hg tool doesn't cache my login session somehow I have to
generate a new one
04:33 < s|k> you can only ever see a generated password once
04:34 < s|k> unless you store it somewhere, which would defeat the extra
security of using two factor in the first place
04:34 < str1ngs> yes generally you save it with the application.  how you do
that with hg I dont know
04:34 < s|k> I'll just generate a new one every time I log in
04:34 < s|k> it's not that hard
04:34 < s|k> are \r \n \t and ' ' the only whitespace characters that
matter?
04:35 < f2f> no
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04:36 < s|k> const GoWhitespace = 1<<'\t' | 1<<'\n' |
1<<'\r' | 1<<' '
04:36 < s|k> http://golang.org/src/pkg/scanner/scanner.go
04:36 < s|k> looks like it though
04:37 < f2f> http://golang.org/src/pkg/unicode/tables.go
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04:40 < s|k> is \f considered whitespace?
04:41 < f2f> ask unicode.IsSpace(): http://golang.org/pkg/unicode/#IsSpace
04:42 < s|k> thank you
04:42 < f2f> what i'm getting at is that there's a definitive answer and you
needn't worry about it.  refer to the right package and expect it to work.  in the
rare cases where it doesn't it's probably a bug :)
04:42 < s|k> should the GoWhitespace be changed?
04:43 < s|k> I'm trying to get a patch committed into go
04:43 < s|k> whatever I can
04:43 < s|k> :P
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04:44 < f2f> the only reason, besides a bug, why GoWhitespace may not be
using the unicode definition is if it would introduce a dependency cycle in the
standard libs.  i don't know where GoWhitespace comes from, so i can't speculate
on that
04:45 < s|k> it comes from scanner
04:46 < s|k> so what I was thinking is
04:46 < s|k> wouldn't it be nice if there were a whitespace constant in the
string package
04:46 < f2f> ah, i see
04:46 < s|k> so that you could use strings.Trim and feed it a whitespace
constant defined in strings
04:46 < s|k> because otherwise I'm adding "\n\t\r " every time
04:46 < f2f> there's a difference between allowable whitespace in go souce
code and allowable whitespace in any text
04:46 < s|k> oh
04:47 < s|k> what do you think about my idea for a whitespace constant in
strings for strings.Trim?
04:48 < s|k> oh
04:48 < s|k> there's a TrimSpace
04:48 < s|k> :/
04:49 < f2f> why are you adding \n\t\r?  what function in strings do you
need?  strings.Fields incorporates unicode.IsSpace to give you what you probably
need.
04:49 < s|k> return TrimFunc(s, unicode.IsSpace)
04:49 < s|k> yep
04:49 < s|k> I was just looking to contribute in some way, but turns out
that isn't a good way
04:49 < f2f> you should've been here earlier ;)
04:50 < s|k> earlier today?
04:50 < s|k> :P
04:50 < f2f> no, earlier in Go's history, when things were less settled.  i
wrote the original Fields()
04:50 < s|k> ah
04:50 < f2f> but i haven't contributed anything in a while because what's
there covers my needs :)
04:51 < s|k> hrm
04:51 < f2f> go moves very fast and there are few holes that are not plugged
very quickly
04:51 < s|k> maybe there's a test I can write or something
04:51 < s|k> so not easy to get patches in then?
04:51 < s|k> getting a patch in closure library is a huge pain
04:51 < f2f> it's easy if they make sense
04:52 < s|k> http://code.google.com/p/go/issues/list
04:52 < s|k> maybe there's something in there
04:52 < f2f> yes, go for it
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09:45 < moraes> go'od morning.
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10:01 < foocraft> Morning, moraes.
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14:15 < hokapoka> Is it me or are fridays always quite in here?
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14:16 < dlowe> sssh.  You're disturbing it.
14:17 < hokapoka> heh
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16:10 < xyproto> If you were to write a 2D-game, and needed coordinates:
would you use a complex number or a struct with x and y?
16:11 < shoenig> the later
16:11 < leterip> the only advantage i see to using complex is rotation is a
multiply
16:12 < zozoR> use a vector
16:12 < leterip> but if you used a struct you could make it a simple
function call anyway
16:12 < zozoR> go-sdl does not have rotation as far as i know
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16:18 < s|k> why does a complex number help with coordinates?
16:18 < aiju> s|k: rotation is easier
16:18 < aiju> and other operations
16:19 < f2f> s|k, see quaternions on wikipedia :)
16:20 < s|k> I want to get better at mathmatics
16:20 < s|k> so much to learn
16:22 < aiju> wikipedia is a bad source
16:22 < f2f> yes, screw wikipedia.  just ask on irc and someone will explain
:)
16:22 < aiju> get a fucking book
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16:24 < aiju> even the worst math books i've seen usually beat the average
internet content
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16:28 < niemeyer> aiju: You're obviously not taking the Khan Academy into
account there
16:29 < niemeyer> s|k: Have fun: http://www.khanacademy.org/
16:29 < niemeyer> s|k: Start here:
http://www.khanacademy.org/video/complex-numbers--part-1
16:29 < niemeyer> ;)
16:30 < leterip> i dont think wikipedia is that bad for math
16:30 < leterip> ive never seen it say something wrong at least
16:30 < aiju> haha
16:30 < aiju> okay, i never have with math
16:31 < aiju> still doesn't make it good content, thoug
16:31 < leterip> yeah i only meant for math
16:31 < leterip> between wikipedia and wolfram mathworld you can usually get
a good overview on a topic
16:31 < leterip> sometimes with some proofs
16:32 < aiju> or skip all this and _get a book_
16:32 < f2f> math is hard.  let's go shopping -- barbie
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16:45 < KBme> reading is hard, fuck books
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16:58 < s|k> niemeyer: thanks :)
16:59 < s|k> I know about complex numbers a bit
16:59 < s|k> just not enough to know about rotation and Quaternions
16:59 < s|k> I finished college with just pre-calculus, which is a travesty
I have learned (I majored in a social science but since have become a programmer
professionally)
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17:03 < ww> s|k: no calculus involved...  see
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transformation_matrix
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17:04 < ww> one type of transformation is a rotation...
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17:04 < ww> which works by multiplying the transform matrix with the vector
you want to rotate
17:05 < ww> i've never done it but since complex numbers are a built in type
in go, and support multiplication directly, this might be slightly more efficient
when using them
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17:06 < ww> but that seems like a little bit of a kludge which wouldn't
generalise to higher dimensions anyways
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17:06 < ww> i'd be inclined to use something like
http://code.google.com/p/gomatrix/ by skelterjohn
17:07 < ww> would make for clearer code
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17:13 < xyproto> How come interface{} can both be used for a list of
required methods, and to contain values to be checked with .(type) and fetched
with .(int) and friends?  That's just crazy.  How's the internal representation
for all this?  :)
17:14 < xyproto> Oh. I think I understand.  interface{} is completely
different from an interface that actually requires methods to be implemented?
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17:15 < f2f> xyproto:
http://research.swtch.com/2009/12/go-data-structures-interfaces.html
17:18 < xyproto> f2f: great, thank you!  :)
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17:29 < niemeyer> xyproto: The "checked" and "fetched" in your sentence is
the same thing, actually
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17:29 < niemeyer> xyproto: The semantics for interface{} and interface{
String() string } are the same..
17:30 < niemeyer> xyproto: The latter matches an object that contains at
least a String() string method
17:30 < niemeyer> xyproto: The former matches an object that contains at
least no methods (IOW, _any_).
17:30 < niemeyer> s/object/value
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17:32 < xyproto> niemeyer: I see, I think.
17:37 < jessta> xyproto: note that "inteface{}" isn't special, you can do
this too, func someFunc(a interface{String()})
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18:03 < f2f> i had not checked the abovementioned article in quite some
time.  looks like some choice comments have been added by the "formal language
theory" community under the moniker "Anonymous"
18:04 < f2f> :)
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18:13 < xyproto> f2f: :)
18:14 < niemeyer> f2f: Hopefully arguments can be debated on their own merit
rather than on who said them
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18:17 < f2f> i don't think there were any arguments there.  only
allegations.  mentioning who posted them was just a pointer for identification of
the comment in question
18:18 < niemeyer> f2f: s/arguments/allegations/ then :-)
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18:20 < f2f> with the proposed change I can't help but agree with this
statement: "Experienced language designers look at Go and just shake their heads."
18:21 < f2f> and add "so do horses!"
18:23 < TheMue> *lol*
18:24 < niemeyer> f2f: Good, you're judging the allegation now, rather than
who posted them
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18:24 < TheMue> some build languages for computer science, pure on a
theoretical level, others build languages for practical purposes
18:25 < niemeyer> f2f: I also agree with the statement, FWIW..
18:25 < niemeyer> f2f: Considering it doesn't state in which direction the
head is shaken ;-)
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18:28 < jessta> "experienced language designers"...like Rob and Ken.
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18:29 < niemeyer> TheMue: Reminds me a bit of the first few flights of a new
airplane when they invite the team to fly.
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18:30 < TheMue> niemeyer: At least it's not boring *smile*
18:30 < moraes> hey.  which article is this?
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18:31 < f2f>
http://research.swtch.com/2009/12/go-data-structures-interfaces.html
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18:32 < moraes> thanks.
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19:00 < moraes> seriously, i got the best go-related project name evah.
http://code.google.com/p/gorilla/
19:02 < kergoth> nice.
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19:03 < fzzbt> nice.
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19:07 < nicka> gofy is better
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19:13 < f2f> i'm waiting for "goto" and "gosub" personally
19:13 < f2f> before i announce a winner :)
19:14 < aiju> Gonorrhea is already a registered Gofy trademark
19:16 < f2f> how about "goniocraniometry"?
19:17 < f2f> gonoblastidium?
19:17 < f2f> gobiesociform -- sounds like something vaguely related to
google+
19:17 < f2f> fun with dict/words
19:18 < TheMue> the first one has been developed 1991 and works on port 70:
gopher
19:20 * ww considers again raising the suggestion that monads be added to the
language...
19:20 < f2f> continuations?
19:21 < ww> ...  would be called...
19:24 < nicka> have any gopher clients been written in go yet?
19:25 < dlowe> s/in go yet/in the past decade/
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19:27 < aiju> s/in go yet/in this century/
19:27 < nicka> I was asking in the theme of retarded wordplay
19:28 < nicka> not because I actually want to use a gopher client
19:28 < f2f> retarded wordplay is what we're best at :)
19:29 < dlowe> hence the language nam
19:29 < dlowe> e
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19:31 < f2f> plan9: bad movie puns.  go: retarded wordplay.
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19:32 < aiju> i still like the movie puns better
19:32 < aiju> Go should have been called Leni
19:32 < jessta> nicka: andrew wrote a gopher server
https://github.com/nf/gogopherd
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19:33 < dlowe> Go should have been called akarsi
19:33 < dlowe> cause I just banged that out on my keyboard and it's easy to
search for
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19:37 < moraes> more bad puns: akarsi (aka akarsi)
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19:40 < dlowe> Akarsi (aka Go)?
19:41 < aiju> Go should be called be
19:41 < aiju> to make it even harder to search for
19:42 < niemeyer> f2f: Reminds me of "return without gosub"
19:43 < dlowe> Gosub would be a hilarious name for a language
19:45 < moraes> it it was called "s", people wouldn't even be able to recur
to "slang" for searches.
19:46 < f2f> niemeyer: "basic programmers never die, they just gosub without
return"
19:46 < niemeyer> f2f: Hehe..  :)
19:46 < niemeyer> f2f: I'm surprised..  just googled and there are _modern_
questions about this message
19:47 < niemeyer> I think it was in the 80s when I used to see this
19:47 < f2f> i googled too.  seems to be from vbasic+web forms or something
19:47 < f2f> 84-86 for me.  my finest basic programming days :)
19:47 < niemeyer> +1!  ;)
19:49 < knowmercy> I've been writing code for, what I thought was a long
time...  but you guys have been at it for almost as long as I've been alive
19:49 < knowmercy> Jeeze, since 99 I've been writing code
19:49 < niemeyer> knowmercy: I've been at it for almost as long as I've been
alive too..  ;-)
19:50 < knowmercy> I'll be 31 this year
19:50 < f2f> in 86 i was 10.  one night we sat down with a friend and typed
the whole snake byte in basic from a book listing.  proudest achievement for me to
this day :)
19:51 < knowmercy> did you save it on tape?
19:51 < Kahvi> knowmercy, I can say same to you.  Born in '93 and started
coding in '05 or so.
19:51 < knowmercy> ok, if you consider that to be "programming" then I've
been at it since about 90
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19:51 < f2f> no.  it was a disappointment the next day when he said the game
was "gone"
19:51 < niemeyer> f2f: Input?
19:51 < knowmercy> I had my commodore vic20 and then commodor64
19:51 < f2f> keyboard
19:52 < niemeyer> f2f: Not sure if that was international..  there was a
magazine around here named Input
19:52 < Kahvi> Sadly I haven't finished any project worth mentioning yet.
19:53 < knowmercy> I've finished a lot of projects that aren't worth
mentioning ;)
19:53 < f2f> maybe it was a copy from the magazine.  the book was in
bulgarian (except the basic in it, of course) and it ran on an appleII clone
called Pravetz'82
19:53 < niemeyer> Kahvi: Just a matter of time..  coding is practice really
19:54 < niemeyer> Kahvi: As long as you're coding and doing mistakes you can
learn from, you're evolving
19:54 < dlowe> Though it's important to finish projects, even if they're not
worth mentioning
19:55 < dlowe> Starting is easy.  Finishing is hard.
19:55 < f2f> nice projects finish last :p
19:55 < Kahvi> niemeyer, I've noticed that.  I believe I'm able to do lots
of interesting stuff if I just happen to have the correct motivation.
19:56 < niemeyer> Kahvi: That's the spirit
19:56 < moraes> niemeyer, http://goo.gl/FV2N6
19:56 < Kahvi> And I enjoy what I do even though my greatest achievements
are stuff like packet logger for a game and some server barebones.  :)
19:56 < niemeyer> dlowe: Some of them, at least..  agreed
19:57 < niemeyer> moraes: Wow :)
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19:57 < knowmercy> I'm trying to find some of my work in the web archive
19:59 < moraes> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Input_Magazine
19:59 < knowmercy> I wish those openbsd syscalls would get in tree!
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20:19 < sl> is someone actually working on making go run on openbsd again?
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20:26 < Kahvi> sl, I think there is.
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20:34 < sl> some guy posted on ports@openbsd today and got chewed out for
asking the same question.  :)
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20:40 < knowmercy> joel sing is workign on it
20:40 < knowmercy> he and some other folks
20:40 < knowmercy> it's really quite close
20:40 < knowmercy> and, of course you're going to get chewed out on
ports@...
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20:43 < knowmercy> openbsd guys...  can't live with them, can't really be
safe on the internet without them
20:43 < knowmercy> hrmm, I'm actually wearing my openbsd shirt today
20:43 < knowmercy> :)
20:44 < fzzbt> how do i spawn new processes
20:44 < aiju> exec package, i think
20:44 < aiju> you can't fork go processes :(
20:45 < fzzbt> hmm
20:46 < str1ngs> os.StartProcess or exec package
20:46 < aiju> os.CreateProcessEx would have been a more appropriate name
20:46 < str1ngs> exec package is easier to work with unless you need complex
pipes
20:47 < fzzbt> exec seems to be only for external commands
20:47 < sl> knowmercy: my openbsd shirt is almost still a shirt :)
20:47 < knowmercy> :)
20:47 < aiju> fzzbt: you can't fork, period
20:48 < knowmercy> github fork golang
20:48 < knowmercy> :)
20:48 < aiju> talking about fork(2) here
20:48 < fzzbt> but i wanna
20:48 < fzzbt> why not
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20:48 < fzzbt> go is flawed
20:48 < aiju> apparently it forks up process state rather horribly
20:48 < aiju> no pun intended
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20:52 < niemeyer> fzzbt: You can't fork because that's managed internally to
distribute goroutines across multiple threads
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20:52 < knowmercy> so on the ports@ mailing list someone asks a question and
someone thinks it's rude so they tell the guy it's no way to write an email?!?!?
seriously what is wrong with them?
20:52 < knowmercy> I can be rude but you can't ask a question I might
interpret as rude?
20:52 < knowmercy> ugh, this is the one thing about openbsd I hate
20:52 < aiju> hell
20:52 < aiju> this is openbsd
20:53 < knowmercy> I know most of those folks by name and I still can't
stand some of the stuff they do
20:53 < aiju> You accept how we do it, and you will shut up, or less service
will be provided in the future.  -- Theo de Raadt
20:53 < sl> it's group dynamics.  everyone tries to mimic theo's tone in an
attempt to gain stature by perceived proximity.
20:53 < knowmercy> oh and by the way that item isn't on our agenda therefore
we berate you!
20:54 < knowmercy> actually, I've contributed stuff to openbsd and once you
help out they actually talk to you in a mostly civil tone
20:54 < sl> you can tell the difference because theo's blasts of hatred are
always based on a viewpoint.
20:55 < knowmercy> yup
20:56 < knowmercy> they are pretty smart folks, but they have techniques for
weeding out noise quickly that are quite abrasive
20:57 < knowmercy> is joel sing in this channel?
20:57 < knowmercy> whoops, time to commute!
20:57 < knowmercy> have a good weekend gents :)
20:57 < aiju> if you commute, you're a communist
20:57 < knowmercy> :)
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21:07 < str1ngs> ?
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21:07 < str1ngs> Please do some other work to give
21:07 < str1ngs> the OS a chance to collect more entropy!  (Need 227 more
bytes)
21:08 < str1ngs> someone give me more entropy !
21:09 < niemeyer> str1ngs: why?
21:09 < schmichael> str1ngs: 4
21:09 < ericvh> any go-dev's present?
21:10 < ericvh> need a good way to test ?a,?c,?l without ?g
21:10 < str1ngs> schmichael: done thanks :P
21:12 < aiju> ericvh: it's easy
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21:12 < aiju> you need functions main·main and main·init
21:12 < aiju> that's it basically
21:12 < aiju> there is runtime·print iirc
21:13 < aiju> runtime·printf
21:13 < niemeyer> It took me a while to figure what you guys were talking
about
21:14 < aiju> there is no point in testing ?a ...
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21:14 < str1ngs> hehe sorry
21:14 < aiju> that 4 joke again?
21:16 < ericvh> kk, just wondering if there were canned unit tests for the
base tools that I didn't trip over yet.
21:17 < str1ngs> ericvh: ah I guess you can set a GOARCH var then run each
test after
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21:18 < str1ngs> ericvh: hmmm or manual run make test in src/cmd/6c etc
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21:19 < str1ngs> but there are not tests there so not sure
21:19 < ericvh> I'm testing a specific arch, just trying to test the
assembler, c compiler, and loader without go.  Have a pseudo-new arch.
21:20 < str1ngs> ya sorry I misread you at first.  you'll have to find test
for those in the tree.  but most tests are for the overall runtime/lib.  and they
dont test those per say
21:20 < str1ngs> as far as I can see not directly.  so you might have to
make your own tests.
21:20 < ericvh> looks like it may not be possible anyways.  tripping over
the "go object" test in ldobj()
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21:24 < ericvh> mmm..nvm, being dumb.  looks like I've got some code in my
loader to fix.
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21:49 < fzzbt> how do i reimport a package during runtime
21:50 < Kahvi> fzzbt, Why would you need to do that?
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22:10 < fzzbt> nvm
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23:24 < NULLZ> hello!
23:25 < NULLZ> does anyone know if there is a physics engine for go?
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23:28 < nicka> http://go-lang.cat-v.org/pure-go-libs
23:28 < nicka> at the bottom, tamias
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23:30 < NULLZ> thx nicka
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--- Log closed Sat Aug 20 00:00:20 2011